| BadSleep | 2013-05-17 18:31:35 |
Hi guys So I was about to ask to implement DarkPriest but the picture hosting didn't work and I decided to gather requests here, instead of polluting the class suggestions. Sinist, if you read it I would be interested in adding it to my game if it doesn't bother you, but I need the pictures.  if anyone want me to test a simple class in my little game (https://www.dropbox.com/s/tzu2lp9yny3z749/freespectrogdx.jar?dl=0, https://www.dropbox.com/s/x6j00s54pf3w4av/freespectro.7z), I propose you discuss with me here. The game is pretty ugly but maybe some of you would be glad testing their ideas. What I would need is the card pictures.
The danger here is that my implementation can be very deceiving, when it would have been nice if it was implemented in Spectromancer.
Currently I don't support a lot of features, so it's probable I won't be able to fulfill your requests, and the game is bugged(hoping not too much).
You can find on this page examples of features not supported: https://github.com/illim/freespectrogdx/wiki
Of course any help in programming, and art is welcome(replacing all the copyrighted pictures would be great). The game run on JVM, I know a lot of users/programmers despise it. The code is a mess, and it's not even interesting to dive into it for education purpose, just to warn you, except maybe for learning what's ugly in code.
some picture credits: https://github.com/illim/freespectro/blob/master/credits.txt
Modified by BadSleep on 2016-06-07 20:40:14 | LaoTse | 2013-05-17 19:08:12 |
Man you have nerves...have you ever heard something about copyrights?
| Sinist | 2013-05-17 19:17:45 |
| Sinist | 2013-05-17 19:19:27 |
Man you have nerves...have you ever heard something about copyrights?
Do you realize that this is non-commercial project, right?
| BadSleep | 2013-05-17 19:28:58 |
About copyright, yes it's a real problem, I started changing stuff. For example some pictures are taken from free images, but it's another work I try to do in parallel. For the Spectromancer cards, well I just renamed some cards, for example Minotaur -> Bull commander. I think it should not cause any commercial problem considering there's already a free version of spectromancer made in Flash which is much more advanced than my game. I will try to change this situations, maybe separate the program from the content, so ppl will be free to copy their spectro pictures into it. Sinist: at least I will try. I can't guarantee the result, and thanks for the pictures.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-17 19:30:01 | LaoTse | 2013-05-17 19:33:41 |
Do you realize that this is non-commercial project, right?
Yes...even more dangerous...you remember what I said about DotA?...
| Sinist | 2013-05-17 19:35:49 |
... Yes...even more dangerous...you remember what I said about DotA?...
I dont want to start that pointless argument again. BadSleep - you are welcome)
Modified by Sinist on 2013-05-17 19:36:12 | BadSleep | 2013-05-17 19:36:05 |
Well it's not that dangerous, considering my work is very amateurish, and maybe more deceiving than anything.I think only the designers of our custom class really can enjoy it!! Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-17 19:36:58 | LaoTse | 2013-05-18 01:05:47 |
Ok, you are welcome BadSleep...I will not even download it, but Sinist waits his whole life for this now...so I think you will make some guys here very happy...and even if it gets a professional mod, it´s worth the risk. (I really don´t want to take the risk, you suffer on not getting it Sinist, lol...)
So you have my ok, but you could have at least asked Estarh for a permission...anyway, good job!
| BadSleep | 2013-05-18 01:57:52 |
Thanks. About Estarth, well I don't know how to ask him(mail support?), and (imho) my copyright problem is mostly a concern for people from deviantart(where are I took most of the pics), and Wizard of Coast(where the other pictures come from) @Sinist: that should be ok for Dark priest, you can try it! @Cooler, if there's a problem, please delete the topic, maybe I should just stop it. The game is not even very fun, so it's not worth going into this kind of headaches. I see it more like an intellectual curiosity. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-18 02:06:49 | LaoTse | 2013-05-18 03:56:16 |
About Estarth, well I don't know how to ask him(mail support?)
Yes, but now that I understand fully, what it is, it´s not really necessary to waste Estarh´s time I think. So take my excuse Sinist, this program is sure not dangerous, and you too BadSleep if you felt offended!
You exchanged all card pics and it´s in Java lol...yes totally useless...no programmer will even look into it...
But you should continue work on it (especially for Sinist ), so maybe you and Sinist can put a lot of the invented classes in it one day...(Btw Sinist, as I said last year, I like the Dark priest theme!)
I´m very noob in programming, but you can maybe solve the skip- and two-cards-problem this way? The turn changes, then you use a trick playing a 0-card on the board (with 0 life), so it´s dead immediatly, so the turn changes again and the second card can be played...for skip same, a 0-card on the board (if skip is clicked) and the turn changes...just an idea but could work lol...well, it doesn´t work if the board is full lol...but maybe you find another trick like creating a slot 7 which is not shown on the board...run a card twice - well, that´s a serious problem lol...
Anyway lol...have fun both of you...
| BadSleep | 2013-05-18 11:06:46 |
There's already lot of newbie projects like mine for Magic : http://www.slightlymagic.net/wiki/List_of_MTG_Engines using python, c++ or java, and I even found another spectromancer project, but too recent to really work. For the missing features, well it's maybe not that hard, but it's surely very boring, because I have to change the AI, which is already a mess, thanks for the suggestions anyway.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-18 11:08:30 | tosher | 2013-05-18 11:20:57 |
Oh, I did not know that there are similar engines, I once stopped at the Construct, on the advice of another person)
I saw your project, to me personally it does not simpotichen externally (
original spektromaner addictive to play, your program is not (
Modified by tosher on 2013-05-18 11:21:42 | BadSleep | 2013-05-18 11:55:50 |
Well spoken, Spectromancer is polished and balanced. AI is good. Mine is not good, and game is unreadable, you would most times ask yourself "huh wtf happened?". I admit I'm more interested in classes that I have no idea how they would be played.
| tosher | 2013-05-18 12:44:00 |
I believe winnings in spectromanser in the fact that it looks simple, catchy catchy card, it is very important that they no pictures of small parts.
This is a problem not only your version of the game, even though I know exactly picture you doing the least.
I think you should look for an ideological kindred spirit who would be engaged in the visual perception of your project.Modified by tosher on 2013-05-18 12:47:08 | Sinist | 2013-05-18 15:53:18 |
I enjoyed your Dark Priest a lot! Very nice work  What classes are you going to add next? Oh - and the only one flaw I have noticed so far: card number 8 never appears  Did you happen to like dark hydra so much more?
Modified by Sinist on 2013-05-18 15:53:39 | BadSleep | 2013-05-18 18:24:14 |
lol I completely forgot him  . That should be fixed now. Thanks for the compliment. Nice design for dark priest, a bit weird. I still don't get the strategy, but it takes time. I really like energy vampire and occultist is maybe my favorite card. About next, I don't know, maybe polish a bit or wait a few days, before asking myself the question. And I have my new bugs, I think I just broke pollination, and I also have a crash with blackmass. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-18 21:19:01 | Sinist | 2013-05-18 18:34:40 |
Well its main strategy is board and hp control - slow but (ideally) inevitable Very vulnerable to rushes though. If you would happen to take other my class, feel free to inform me if you need pictures again | BadSleep | 2013-05-18 21:30:44 |
Well in fact for DarkPriest8, I misinterpreted the cards. I thought the missionary was transformed, because when I read elemental, I thought of the big elemental cards. So I just read the thread again. I think I'm not sure to understand. What does it mean: when enters the game, weakest friendly creature and weakest enemy creature of the same element lose half of current health. Is it only when missionary comes in play, I look for weakest friendly creature(for example master healer has lowest attack), he is earth so I look for opponent creatures with earth(for example troll and elven), then I take the weakest(elven) and halve his life? And "When owner summons special creature, turns itself into black angel", is it the missionary who is transformed or the creature just summoned? (I guess it's the summoned creature considering it's a missionary, but if I read your answer to wave, it's the missionary.) And about the pictures there 4 pictures, which one is black angel, I took them in order, so I guess I was wrong, black angel is the guy in front of the moon right, or is it the guy with black wings? and heretic, the guy with the sword(who also is an angel apparently because of his black wings)? Edit: just fixed a few bugs, betrayer not inflicting owner damage, bug where blackmass on ghost kept ghost on own side, pollination bugged on elementals. Edit2: lol I think I just understood DarkPriest8, there's a timing idea. If I want to kill E11, I will place E1 on my side just before, and if E11 is the only earth card, he will loose half his life, right? Sinist you're insane  Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-19 01:06:48 | LaoTse | 2013-05-19 00:56:39 |
original spektromaner addictive to play, your program is not (
Lol! 6 years of work and still not finished...Yes, it´s the best TCG out at the moment, the AI is awesome good...
Creating a game is very easy. If you have interest in this, here you have a nice plattform: http://www.zillions-of-games.com (has also a dumb AI in lol)
But to make a really good game, you need a good AI, which is actually impossible for the TCG-genre, because TCGs need really an AI, I mean an artificial intelligence, which means, if you translate it correct, an intelligence that can handle abstract problems like hidden elements or a overall strategy, which is still the dominating point for humans in any game.
In Spectro Archy is so good, that we just call him Archy, because we know, that it´s impossible to make such a bot actually, so we handle him as a human, who is catched in a game... He is a real artificial intelligence, and not just an engine that runs loops...In Magic or Shadow Era the bots are so stupid, that it´s no fun to play with them...you see at once that they are just bots and not really AIs lol!
I have great respect for all that are able to programm just bots (like BadSleep)! But programming an AI is an Art, which I just have seen really in Spectromancer at the moment...oh wait...have to go lol...Archy calls me...
| tosher | 2013-05-19 07:32:21 |
I also appreciate the work of developers in the production of AI, but in online games is not important. The development of artificial intelligence can spend a lot of time, constantly improving it.
| LaoTse | 2013-05-19 08:56:37 |
Disagree! How do you improve your playing-skill?
The development of artificial intelligence can take a lot of time, constantly improving it. Some guys are working on this already at least 10 years, and it will take at least another 10 years when it´s useable in games I think...at the moment they try to implement deep probability-calculations, but that´s far not enough, because the mind of a human is far to complex...I have contact to one of the leading heads in the world, which work on this...it´s a life-task...sometimes he says "I gave up!", then he comes with a new idea, but tells me "Omg, that will be a LOT of work!" lol... But when you see the development in chess in the last 20 years...17 years ago Kasparov played against a Supercomputer and just lost because the comp did an awesome move in the final game...today such show-events are impossible, because each kid has a bot now, that can beat Anand (the current World-Champion) with ease...So the programmers will finally find a way...at the latest when they look in Coolers Archy, because they will just find 1 command: "Be a human!" | Sinist | 2013-05-19 09:22:20 |
Well in fact for DarkPriest8, I misinterpreted the cards. I thought the missionary was transformed, because when I read elemental, I thought of the big elemental cards.
So I just read the thread again. I think I'm not sure to understand. What does it mean: when enters the game, weakest friendly creature and weakest enemy creature of the same element lose half of current health. Is it only when missionary comes in play, I look for weakest friendly creature(for example master healer has lowest attack), he is earth so I look for opponent creatures with earth(for example troll and elven), then I take the weakest(elven) and halve his life?
And "When owner summons special creature, turns itself into black angel", is it the missionary who is transformed or the creature just summoned? (I guess it's the summoned creature considering it's a missionary, but if I read your answer to wave, it's the missionary.)
And about the pictures there 4 pictures, which one is black angel, I took them in order, so I guess I was wrong, black angel is the guy in front of the moon right, or is it the guy with black wings? and heretic, the guy with the sword(who also is an angel apparently because of his black wings)?
Edit: just fixed a few bugs, betrayer not inflicting owner damage, bug where blackmass on ghost kept ghost on own side, pollination bugged on elementals.
Edit2: lol I think I just understood DarkPriest8, there's a timing idea. If I want to kill E11, I will place E1 on my side just before, and if E11 is the only earth card, he will loose half his life, right? Sinist you're insane I think that elemental is harder to misinterpret than normal You are right; if your weakest creature belongs to earth, enemy earth one will have its hp halved too. Itself = missionary, of course Missionary - 1st picture heretic - last picture Black angel - 3rd (or 2nd, but 3rd looks cooler) picture
| tosher | 2013-05-19 09:23:45 |
but where does the development of artificial intelligence? We
are talking about the game on its concept, not the machines, which can
partially replace us with a strong opposition and interesting opponent. These
are completely different tasks and spektromanser not among the games
puzzles, where everything depends on the opposing forces, where a person
has the ability to win at ideal speeds, in this game it is not, and we
can not win every game being stronger, not everything depends on us, and I would not say that the best way to enhance the strength of his game is a confrontation with the computer.
and about the years progress, I can tell you this:
no
matter how much you may try, you will never attain the ideal in any
field, you'll be able to constantly improve, but the more you will
continue to do so it would be futile occupation is nikchemu pay a
million problems all his free time, every time you
would get a gain of less and less and by soon it will seem that you are
out on a horizontal line in the chart, which is absolutely useless, it
is better to devote himself to the development of other industries!
| LaoTse | 2013-05-19 09:48:47 |
Lol! Now we are even off-topic in off-topic lol...(Aaaargh Wave... , is this my fault??)
Ok Tosher, create a new topic, if you want discuss (deep) philosophical questions with me...this is Sinist´s and BadSleep´s topic, we are just guests here!
| tosher | 2013-05-19 17:52:51 |
I think we can talk here. For sinista is a common thing - to write off topic. To support the author's theme topic of active and at the top of the list). So if with what you do not agree to write here)
| LaoTse | 2013-05-19 23:08:21 |
But I also not really understand you...can you please repeat the above post in russian? "but where does the development...
If you mean, that if we finally have such a perfect AI (in all games and maybe more lol...), we are pretty damned, I agree!! We are humans and always want the new, even if it will kill us lol...1950 it was the hit itself to have a TV lol (Back to the Future-movie "Nobody has 2 TVs..."), nowadays more and more people also don´t have it, but for a complete other reason...they see how bad it is...New technology tends to be always a disadvantage for the humans finally lol...http://www.spectromancer.com/player.cgi?A=94916&;B=1357342...well the innernet is not soo bad...it´s more the gunverment that makes things like TV finally bad...anyway, it´s pretty cool to work on new technologies or isn´t it?
I see it more like an intellectual curiosity.
The way is the goal, if you reach the goal, you will have to search for a new way lol...(LaoTse, 600 before AD 0)
(Sinist?? You want that I and Tosher go to Super-off-topic? It´s np, Wave can arrange this pretty fast, and I think it´s maybe better lol...)
| Sinist | 2013-05-20 11:09:46 |
(Sinist?? You want that I and Tosher go to Super-off-topic? It´s np, Wave can arrange this pretty fast, and I think it´s maybe better lol...)
It is not my topic, so it depends on BadSleep opinion
| BadSleep | 2013-05-20 13:25:19 |
haha, oh well, I'm lost guys, I don't have any preference and I don't have anything to add on the original topic. DarkPriest has twisted my mind (see the screenie in first post). I need to rest a bit, and come back in the arms of big mama Spectromancer. | LaoTse | 2013-05-20 18:50:59 |
Wow! You are a genius! Now I´m tempted a bit to download Java... | BadSleep | 2013-05-20 22:12:49 |
lol that was not my intention. A new class, at first, it sounds a good idea, to bring new ways of killing, but that also means new ways of being raped.  (btw the real genius is Sinist. He made me discover one of the most ridiculous way to win, playing a betrayer on iceguard)
edit: added restart button, and an anim for blackmass (it was just too much wtf?!?).
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-21 00:42:00 | LaoTse | 2013-05-21 04:10:10 |
btw the real genius is Sinist.
He is more than this... You both are geniuses in your own way, so a perfect team...he has the power, you have the mind...
edit: added restart button
Lol! Your program has a feature, that Spectromancer doesn´t has yet? A restart same game with same cards function like it was in Astral Tournament??
He made me discover one of the most ridiculous way to win, playing a betrayer on iceguard
Sounds like Spectro goes Magic...what I really like on Magic is, that you can turn the whole game with one special card... | BadSleep | 2013-05-21 18:59:53 |
I just felt the need for a restart button after loosing a lot of games. I really doubt the bot is any good(it's just a stupid rusher), the explanation was that some cards were not well balanced(within the class). For example I added this class Lost church, I was not sure if it was balanced. The bot had all the offense card, especially these stupid spells that add 1 point attack, I thought it might have been counterable but my defense cards were too weak. Now I'm nearly sure it was an unwinnable situations, and it's not a good class. I need to rework it some day.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-21 19:24:02 | LaoTse | 2013-05-21 21:31:39 |
Well, if a class is not good, don´t use it in the program...you should think this way "Can this class beat the 16 Spectromancer classes?" The rework will be done in Class-Suggestions, after you have reported there, what´s wrong with the class...
But you have not answered my question:
Lol! Your program has a feature, that Spectromancer doesn´t has yet? A restart same game with same cards function like it was in Astral Tournament?? | BadSleep | 2013-05-22 03:30:50 |
Yes I can restart game, but I can't save it to hard drive, which is quite bad. It would be useful to reproduce these hard situations and test them again after making some class tweaks. Whatever, I wouldn't like this to become too serious. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-22 03:59:50 | LaoTse | 2013-05-24 01:32:15 |
My Desktop-resolution is 1600x1200, so have I always to change my desktop resolution, when I want to play it?
Can´t you make it like Spectromancer, so that the game always fits the screen?
| BadSleep | 2013-05-24 08:53:25 |
Sorry, I hardcoded the window size. I'm constantly switching with my browser when I play so it didn't bother me that much. I'll try to fix it when I can. Maybe next week if I don't forget, I can't change the resolution on my computer and need another one to test it. (just added a reminder for me https://github.com/illim/freespectro/issues?state=open among my many bugs) Modified by BadSleep on 2013-05-24 08:56:01 | BadSleep | 2013-05-31 13:00:23 |
Rainy day yesterday. I added Sinist's Vampire class, and an anecdotic class, Dudemancer by Garcia1000, a class with no special ability. It's not polished and I still need to rework a few stuff, but it's just to let you know.
| Sinist | 2013-05-31 14:44:31 |
Rainy day yesterday. I added Sinist's Vampire class, and an anecdotic class, Dudemancer by Garcia1000, a class with no special ability. It's not polished and I still need to rework a few stuff, but it's just to let you know. Very cool! Btw, why dont blood ties affect ghoul, and nosferatu - friendly creatures? Also some cards seem to have lower stats than in my class suggestion Modified by Sinist on 2013-05-31 14:52:52 | BadSleep | 2013-05-31 15:50:15 |
Clearly copy paste mistakes, should be fixed now. For the problem with blood ties, I don't know, I tried to sacrifice ghoul, or upgrade it, and it seemed to work fine, maybe a weird edge case. Ill check it later. Currently I'm trying to add Elementalist :).
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-01 01:10:08 | BadSleep | 2013-06-01 09:13:05 |
Should be ok for elementalist, at least for now, as I didn't made any animation. Congrats for the nice cards for vampire and elementalist, I think my favorite are Flock, Acolyte, Aristocrat, Sylph(maybe too good with overlord) and Archphoenix. The one I don't really like is Avalanche, and maybe Mansion I couldn't use well in the late game. (Now I need to play and gather the bugs . And sorry I didn't fix the screen size, the texture were too ugly when zoomed. It wasn't as easy as I thought.) One question: is frost lightning supposed to remove any effect(currently I just prevent the blocked card from attacking, and from using the effects on start/end turn). For example if orc chieftain is blocked, do the neighbors loose their attack bonus? Edit: Sorry it's not ok, I just realize that blocking a slot is not blocking a card. You want the card(if any on the slot) to be destroyed, and the slot not usable any more right? Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-01 13:54:45 | Sinist | 2013-06-01 16:08:54 |
You want the card(if any on the slot) to be destroyed, and the slot not usable any more right? No, it would be too broken. You can target only empty slot. Thanks for great work, again! 
| BadSleep | 2013-06-01 17:44:44 |
Alright! This is what I didn't get, that I could only target empty slot. There was, stuck in my head, the image of a creature blocked in the frost. Well, I will try to fix this later, I don't have my computer for programming for now. Thanks for the compliment, even if my work has the taste of something unfinished, with the missing animations and sounds. Probably another bug, I noticed the ai is constantly playing Sylph alone!
Man I love the idea of Aristocrat, only fighting with the weakest, a coward creature at cost 7 lol.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-01 17:46:49 | Sinist | 2013-06-01 18:43:59 |
Dont worry, it looks cool! I even think that your version is better But then you would have to delete second effect in otder to make card somewhat balanced. Yeah, my vampires are nowhere nearly as brave (and overpowered) as guys from gathering Power
Edit - after death of frozen troll AI managed to summon fire 7 on its place! Hmm...
Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-01 18:56:03 | BadSleep | 2013-06-01 19:05:08 |
Dont worry, it looks cool! I even think that your version is better But then you would have to delete second effect in otder to make card somewhat balanced.
Yeah, my vampires are nowhere nearly as brave (and overpowered) as guys from gathering Power
Edit - after death of frozen troll AI managed to summon fire 7 on its place! Hmm...
Yeah, it's my mistake, I didn't block the slot, just the creature. I was thinking about changing the spell in a creature card, that would be invincible, with 0 attack. I have a question about that, if the slot is blocked, and I put a creature in front of it, is he supposed to inflict damage to opponent when he attacks, like if the slot was empty, or his attack is supposed to be blocked?
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-01 19:05:47 | Sinist | 2013-06-01 19:07:47 |
Like empty I suppose...
| BadSleep | 2013-06-01 19:40:43 |
Interesting
Edit: fixed
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-03 15:51:27 | BadSleep | 2013-06-13 10:35:34 |
Just for information. I added a class called Warp. It would terrible in Spectromancer, especially against Cultist, so I didn't even post it in class suggestions. 1) Errant 4/19. Hide in shadow after killing a creature, come back when damaged. 2) EarthQuake Spell. Deals to opponent creatures damage equals to their mana 3) Cloak 4/18. Spawned onto another owner creature. When die restore the creature.(Can't cloak himself) 4) Photographer 3/20 If there's already a photographer, owner slots is reverted to the state when last one was spawned 5) Schizo 5/22. When summoned, opposite creature lose his abilities until schizo die. 6) Ram 6/26. Opposite creature is destroyed and opponent get his mana back -2. 7) Stranger ?/30. Attack is highest opponent mana. When summoned, take effects of opposite slot. 8) WarpQueen 6/32. Opponent creatures lose their ability until end of next owner turn. Deals 5 damage to each of them. I think Cloak is the best card here, even if a bit hard to use. Note: I imagined some of the cards, walking in the street, trying to loose myself in my own town, thinking about illusion, and wanted to create a class called "Eye". Then I played Spectromancer, and had a tons of lost games, especially one against multiple turtles+master healer. WarpQueen and Stranger comes a bit from that. Maybe I should have called this class "Bitterness". Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-13 13:36:21 | BadSleep | 2013-06-18 13:32:21 |
I don't know if Wavelength read this topic, but I was thinking about adding a dummy implementation of Dreamweaver. Can I? I would like to have a different class style to play with. Considering that I'm probably the only one player of my own game(very bugged btw), with maybe 2 other fellows occasionally, and also that the class is a bit old, I hope there's no problem about that. I know that the class suggestions are dedicated to Spectromancer devs, so if it's no, I'm ok with it. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-18 13:40:59 | LaoTse | 2013-06-18 14:56:47 |
The Class-Suggestions-Section was once created by the devs for GoP...so at the moment, the only use of this section is your little game...Imo you should not take any original classes in (have seen Mechanician in your game), so Dreamweaver is no problem...(one of the best I think, with already 8 pics from Sinist) What are you waiting for, go implement it!
The only classes you can not implement are Sinist´s classes, because he has Copyrights now...(Don´t think, that you need to ask him...)
You even help the devs...Estarh has an own program anyway...but you save him a little time, by pre-testing interesting classes...
Btw, when do I get my fullscreen? (13 open, 12 closed, but just the first 7 are important at the moment...you are stuck?)
| BadSleep | 2013-06-18 15:34:31 |
Oh I didn't know that, but maybe there will be a new expansion, and the suggestions (at least the last ones) could find their way into it. I guessed Estarh had some tools, for testing and balancing. Maybe he let his archmages play against themselves and gather the stats at the end. My program is too slow for that. Maybe he use some abstract formulas from game theory. I really doubt that my pretesting has some big value, the ai is very stupid(especially for long games), and there are no animation. It can just give a general idea of the result. For the fullscreen, yes I'm a little bit stuck. I'm horrible in graphic programming(aliasing problem with full screen), and my computer with the bigger screen is at my other home(I sleep at my parents currently, I need them to help me for a few things). Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-18 17:40:36 | BadSleep | 2013-06-18 16:40:45 |
ok should be done for Dreamweaver, without any animation though(already started yesterday evening to verify if it was feasible). Let's hope there's not too much bugs.
For Mecanician, it's Troopers now, a completely original class by Garcia1000. Any similarity with an existing class is just accidental!
| Sinist | 2013-06-18 17:10:13 |
Nice work, again! I believe your thread is more than worthy being moved to class suggestions section Or at very least be fixed at the top, like my class catalogue. By the way, do you think you can make AI do something than rushing (even though he is pretty good at rush)? | BadSleep | 2013-06-18 17:54:03 |
For the AI, I'm stuck currently. It's really no good, I tried to change the heuristic but it's not enough. He still put spider in one free slot, let E5 in a corner, and stupid stuff like that. There's a webpage http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/feature/44 where they explain the choices they made for Duels of the Planeswalkers, maybe I should try to learn from it. For the thread I don't know, I'm comfortable here, no highlight = no pressure. I still haven't made any animation for Inferno and Armageddon.  And what's this copyright story Sinist, is it for Prospectrogramma? | Sinist | 2013-06-18 18:00:42 |
Ok, I see... No pressure, sure... but this way much less people get to know (and have fun) your creation. Just think about it What copyright? It is nothing but a way to differ my class suggestions from too... numerous creations of Great Magisters And Prospectrogramma itself is not commercial project, you know.
Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-18 18:01:08 | BadSleep | 2013-06-18 18:10:46 |
ah ok, yes not commercial, I was wondering if that changed, in case it was targeted for ipads ... For the thread, I was thinking maybe adding a link in the catalog near the class link, like what you made for the illustrations, or an asterisk to tell the reader there's a way to try the class, or just a link to this page, I don't know.
| BadSleep | 2013-06-21 15:16:16 |
Added Sinist's Moutain King, for the love of dwarves. It's very complex(code is complete mess) so there's probably lot of bugs. (for what I know Berserker is bugged if W6 on his right) It's also very hard to debug, considering the cards have a secondary state, and some of the effects are very situational. Thank you Sinist, now I can forget the (imho)terrible Dwarves from Mech class. @LaoTse, About the Troopers class, I needed a realistic class to challenge the others, that's why I hesitate to remove it. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-21 15:25:29 | Sinist | 2013-06-21 15:41:43 |
It is very cool that you managed to add interesting special abiility!
AI apprentice? Hmm. So how many levels of difficulty are you going to add? Will all of them be rushers?
| BadSleep | 2013-06-21 16:03:23 |
Hehe, apprentice... In reality it's not a level of difficulty, sorry to misguide you, just a different heuristic i wanted to test. (rushomon is simple life delta, dealer is life delta/mana cost, apprentice and junior takes kill ratio and opponent mana into account but not that much) Anyway, the result is practically the same, just rushomon I'm almost sure he won't try to kill E5 . Sorry I know that to really test a class, I need a good AI who play the long game. Moutain King, I was curious about the result and liked the dwarf theme. That's a quite twisted class, maybe too complicated. Sometimes I'm wondering if game is bugged or is it the expected effect, and I still don't know for sure. For example, I had this configuration sheldman(full hp)/sheldman/F3(full hp), then stone rain. Surprise, the 3 survived. Stone rain damage /2 -> 13 absorbed from f3 and first sheldman as spell damage. So the sheldman in the middle take 26 damage, because of hird he survive to 1 life, and we have in the final sheldman(2hp), sheldman(1hp), f3(2hp).
Tell me if you need to tweak a bit. I noticed that Ballista was raped by F2 for example.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-21 16:08:45 | Sinist | 2013-06-21 16:31:01 |
Oh, now I see what is going. Thanks for explanation. Maybe it is worth asking developers about the way they have created their own, very good archmage? Hmm, you are probably right. Shieldman is tad overpowered comparing to another defensive low level card - holy guard. Imho it is safe to tone down its hp a bit. As for ballista... well, every card needs to have at least some counters! | BadSleep | 2013-06-21 16:42:13 |
Ah ok it's shieldman not sheldman . I don't know if it needs balancing, it's just a very particular situation I had. He already has very low hp.  Damn, just noticed that game crashed with berserker vs crossbow. (Edit fixed) For archmage, you're right, maybe I should ask them, I have some doubts they reveal anything but who knows.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-21 17:06:46 | Sinist | 2013-06-21 18:23:31 |
It is up to you, but if shieldman proves to be too strong against AI... Nothing ventured, nothing gained, after all By the way, I have one more dwarves version, quite different from mountain king: http://www.spectromancer.com/forum.cgi#pageid=1913 Do you like it?
Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-21 18:24:15 | BadSleep | 2013-06-21 19:13:11 |
Yes I noticed there were other dwarves version. You prefer this one? I'm not sure about the reasons why I choose Moutain King over Dwarves, maybe the feature "can't be healed", I didn't want to code, and soldier was too close to other cards I had, also Moutain Kind had this "run out of turn" I was curious about the result. About balance I don't know which one is better, and I still don't have the right feeling about Moutain King, needs to play more. | Sinist | 2013-06-21 19:31:30 |
Okay, okay. I didnt mean that it is better to replace mountain king with this class. I just thought that maybe you would want to incorporate it in freespectro as well (since you seem to like those short beardmen ) if you havent seen it yet P.S. I recommend you to rename this topic (or create a new one) into smth like "my free Spectro-like game" if you want to attract some critics and players Right now it seems that almost nobody posts comments here, and it is a pity...
Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-21 19:31:43 | BadSleep | 2013-06-21 21:51:34 |
Yes, maybe one day, I admit this class was a pain to program, but maybe it would be easier now ;). So we're at least 2 liking these short beardmen. I had a great souvenir of a french comic book I read when I was kid called "Legendes des contrees oubliees", would give Legends of forgotten countries, in English. After the death of their king, a group of dwarves was chosen to travel through fantastic and dangerous countries to find their new king. It's mostly for kids. I guess kiddies like dwarves as they're smaller than adults like them, and still they have to behave heroically. (not pretending I'm tall now) I don't know how to rename the title XD, but I suppose not a lot of people read the forum, and even less the class suggestions or off topic section. Please don't worry too much about it. I tried to convince some people to play Spectromancer once, but they didn't care much and some of them said it was ugly. I can't imagine their reaction if I showed my small game.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-21 21:51:49 | LaoTse | 2013-06-22 01:16:27 |
@LaoTse, About the Troopers class, I needed a realistic class to challenge the others, that's why I hesitate to remove it.
Ah ok, I see, np!
Important is this: https://github.com/illim/freespectro/issues?state=open
When the game becomes playable, I will maybe create a new topic...(No haste Sinist, give him all the time he needs! I go actually with, it will never be a complete playable game, which would be a pity, but no pressure at all to you BadSleep...)
The very greatest things begin in the very smallest...(LaoTse)
| BadSleep | 2013-06-25 15:05:01 |
Thanks Lao, i discussed a bit with Ivan by mail, and he was kind enough to give me a few hints on how works the archmage, just enough to understand I'm very far from having a decent AI. So this project is on pause now. It's just a toy program btw, and I need to focus on other things irl, or just pass more time improving my play in Spectromancer.
| Sinist | 2013-06-25 15:21:45 |
Thanks Lao, i discussed a bit with Ivan by mail, and he was kind enough to give me a few hints on how works the archmage, just enough to understand I'm very far from having a decent AI. So this project is on pause now. It's just a toy program btw, and I need to focus on other things irl, or just pass more time improving my play in Spectromancer. It is a pity. Well, I hope wou will get inspiration (and free time and desire to continue modifying) for your project back soon | FORESTRY | 2013-06-25 21:24:55 |
Could you explain how you programmed the AI for its decision making?
I mean, already from your vague mention of "Killrate" or whatever you call it I got inspired and im working on something, so other programming ideas could be translated to strategical thought and planning.
| BadSleep | 2013-06-25 22:47:36 |
Well this is quite bad, not sure it will inspire you, I really cannot be proud of it so, ahem, basically something like: from the simplest, player life - bot life, to something really stupid like a combination of (threshold + opponent life delta/start life) * (cost of creature killed ratio between player and bot) * (mana ratio) * (player mana ratio), with mana being sum(manas) or with a progressive value mana^2 and mana^3 if special. It's obvious that it's a very idiot function, but I just tried to have different play styles and, no surprise it doesn't work at all! My goal was just to tell to the AI, stop playing Noctule first, and kill my hermit, ffs!! I'm very far from having a behavior like, let's wait dragon to play tornado.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-25 22:48:18 | FORESTRY | 2013-06-25 23:13:51 |
Well, for automated creature-target prioratization I think my table of HP-Mana ratios could be of some use if you can code it into the AI, did you happen to read about it in my thread? Basically any creature that is mana-expensive and has low HPs is a priority target (example: Elf Hermit), versus a mana-cheap creature with a lot of HPs is a low priority (example: Forest Sprite).
The "kill-rate" im working on is basicly this equation (Creature Attack * Creature HPs / Mana):
For rushing, it would look like this (creature attack * creature HP):
Berserker: 4*16=64
Bargul: 8*25=200
Dragon: 9x40=360
And for longer term strategies it could look like this (creature attack * creature HP / mana cost):
Berserker: 4*16/1=64
Bargul: 8*25/8=25
Dragon: 9x40/12=30
In the first variant, cost-efficiency is not sought after, its just about damage output and presence which would work for classes like Forest, Illusion or Cult, while in the second variant it does have an implicit cost-efficiency hard coded into it which would work for classes like Demon, Holy or Necro.
| FORESTRY | 2013-06-25 23:14:25 |
| BadSleep | 2013-06-25 23:52:06 |
Nice. I'm trying these days(and probably for the future) to avoid thinking about anything related to computer science, but weather forecasts say rainy day for friday. Maybe a good day to spend some time on it.
Thanks for the tip, seems worth a try. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-26 00:28:52 | Sinist | 2013-06-26 08:12:48 |
BadSleep, what do you think about this class suggestion? http://www.spectromancer.com/forum.cgi#pageid=3837 Maybe you will implement it in freespectro when you will have more time (if it is possible within current mechanics of course)? but weather forecasts say rainy day for friday. Maybe a good day to spend some time on it.
Now, there is one really good way to make forecast reliable... http://www.spectromancer.com/forum.cgi#pageid=3226P.S. Can you make hotseat mod? It would be very cool since testing some strategies against so rush-y AI is almost impossible P.P.S. One more bug: dwarve 6 doesnt affect cards summoned by dark priest with help of priest 8. Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-26 09:14:59 | BadSleep | 2013-06-26 10:53:46 |
Darksider looks like an interesting class, but sadly, it seems not easy to add to my game (black knight and black dragon). For hotseat, there was a multiplayer feature, where I could run 2 games on the same computer, but it's bugged now. I just added to my issue list. Nice one, for dwarve6, I guess problem of priest 8 is that he deals damage to the creature summoned but the creature is replaced by another just after. Added to my bug list. PS: About the AI, for the long game, problem is that the AI has to wait for a card. Currently the bot works like this: He take all possible moves for next turn, then all possible moves for the opponent(if board is empty he's too slow to consider them all), then simulate a few random turns. The most promising turns is then promoted, and the bot runs hundred of random simulation again before making the decision. Due to random policy and limited length of simulation, there's a very tiny chance that he see that dragon+possible spell-> tornado or combination of fast cards=not loose. Instead he will spam A5 or A2... Modified by BadSleep on 2013-06-26 11:08:48 | Sinist | 2013-06-26 14:17:57 |
I see But maybe you will give it a try (I am not going to post any more classes for a long time anyway)? Since there has already been represented cards with magic immunity - in Dorlak campaign... And hellbot as remote analogue of dark knight ;-) You are always welcome!) P.S. This looks rather complex, but maybe it is just me) Still, hotseat would make testing different classes mechanics much more interesting Well, Cooler and Estarh were rather helpful with Prospectrogramma - I am sure they can give you some advices about improving AI.
Modified by Sinist on 2013-06-26 14:18:30 | BadSleep | 2013-07-02 19:05:24 |
Sorry, I couldn't make good use of your advice Forestry. I wasted my AI code enough to make it look more random than before(used hp mana ratio, with my stupid mana evaluation (power of 2 or power of 2.5 if special), but also tried to consolidate random simulation, add a power/board ratio symmetric to kill ratio, but for placing cards ...). Any good choice may be drown in the mud of other probably dumb ideas of mine.
About Darksider, Sinist, with a few hacks, black knight doesn't seem too hard. If there are 2 black knight on board, the result could be weird, the effect would favor last summoned. For black dragon, it's great that there's a similar card in Spectromancer, but I think I won't be able to do that ever.
I hope secretly that your pause in creating class will give birth to new insane ideas, who knows. I truly enjoyed Moutain King. Berserker is one of my favorite card, even if it seems to be not so powerful, has a better feeling than Chastiser to me ;).Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-02 19:28:45 | Sinist | 2013-07-04 06:24:15 |
Black knight is workable? So you added Darksider (without 8th card)? If so, it is very cool! (Sadly I am unable to sun spectro right now)
It is a pity ut maybe you can make it with only spell immu8nity, not abilities immunity? Sirry if I bother you, it is ujust that I believe this card (and this class) to be one of my best
Sure, I will post new classes! Not very soon though... As for now, you might enjoy taking look at Master of wind, or Wood elves, or Shaman, even fresh High Priest. All of them are rather creative
| Sinist | 2013-07-04 06:26:11 |
Btw, I am going to edit Darsider now | BadSleep | 2013-07-05 11:19:17 |
hmm, no, I'm not adding Darksider, sorry. My program is not flexible enough for it. If I had an idea about how to add Black dragon, I would try, but I don't want to make an incoherent class, with a bugged card. I already have a lot of workarounds and bugs, too much to make another compromise. Btw, I'm not really active on this project anymore. I reach a point where I have to deals with my bugs before adding anything else, and currently I don't have time/ideas to fix them. Just sometimes I find myself dicking with variables to see how the AI behaves. In case I'm not reasonable and add one class this month: Shaman seems cool, but I have this bug about randomness not managed by the AI. Master of wind, I can have problems with Energy vortex and Eternal Storm, but maybe it's ok. High priest: maybe too big for me, like crocodile, I also need time for digestion;), but maybe why not. Wood elves: I don't know and I didn't find the pictures. Nearly forgot, about bug with ballista and darkpriest8, I was wondering, maybe I can fix it, but it will remove the effect of the card that is replaced, for example a4 won't heal before it is replaced by the heretic. I always wondered if that was the expected behavior. I let it like that because I thought there were draws where it was too hard to heal, and dark priest 8 didn't help because it replaced useful card like e1 or w6. Edit: just added a cheap version(no anim) of Master of wind. ps: I don't understand in high priest what are the pictures of sphinx, puzzle, serpent of eternity, guardian mummy?
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-08 13:58:56 | BadSleep | 2013-07-09 00:36:21 |
| BadSleep | 2013-07-09 11:42:50 |
Sinist, if you read this, can you tell me where I can find
the pictures of the secondary creatures for high priest? Also I may be
interesting in Skald, and there's no picture for dwarf 4/20. These days
it's a bit too hot to do anything, I have some motivation to add a few
classes.
Nice class Master of wind, it's like a twisted version of chronomancer with defense weakness, spirit of thunderstorm(great card!)+squall being the equivalent of chrono7. I'm not just very fond of ball lightning spam in the late game. I need to play more but overall it's quite fun.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-09 11:44:04 | Sinist | 2013-07-09 12:38:09 |
added a page of thoughts and tricks https://github.com/illim/freespectro/wiki/class-guide
(don't read it if you want to discover by yourself. I'm just bored :))
Very good! Nice help for new players. Of course as creator of those classes I am aware of most of those tips ;-)
Dont change air 4 and the rest of healing cards to deal with one bug. It would definitely cause too many troubles.
I will have to check your updated with master of wind freespectro later - no acces yet...
As for elves and shadowmancer (anoher very cool class imho), I will add pictures later.
| Sinist | 2013-07-09 14:42:16 |
Sinist, if you read this, can you tell me where I can find the pictures of the secondary creatures for high priest? Also I may be interesting in Skald, and there's no picture for dwarf 4/20. These days it's a bit too hot to do anything, I have some motivation to add a few classes.
Nice class Master of wind, it's like a twisted version of chronomancer with defense weakness, spirit of thunderstorm(great card!)+squall being the equivalent of chrono7. I'm not just very fond of ball lightning spam in the late game. I need to play more but overall it's quite fun.
Both skald and skald 2.0 have all the pictures available. What did you mean?
You can see appropriate order of illustrations (dont pay attention to background pictures though) for High Priest here: http://prospectro.ru/blog/experiment/1426.html What secondaryycreatures?
| Sinist | 2013-07-09 14:44:33 |
| Sinist | 2013-07-09 15:09:05 |
P.S. I still hope you will manage to make hotseat mode once.  Also, feel free to inform me what else classes from catalogue you would like to see illustrated ;-) | BadSleep | 2013-07-09 15:16:46 |
I was wondering what are the pictures for puzzle 0/6, serpent of eternity 2/8, sun stone 0/22, guarding mummy 4/30, Dwarf 4/20 (Skald2)
And where are the pictures of Wood elves?
| Sinist | 2013-07-09 15:53:54 |
I was wondering what are the pictures for puzzle 0/6, serpent of eternity 2/8, sun stone 0/22, guarding mummy 4/30, Dwarf 4/20 (Skald2)
And where are the pictures of Wood elves? Sadly I have no pictures for them right now :-( Maybe deviantart or google could help...
But here you can find excellent skald illustration from Clever -
(dwarf is not skald 2, it is additional card for skald 8. Btw, do you like class Skald 1.0:?
And alternative vampires illustrations - http://faery.biz/publ/klassy/015_vampiry/2-1-0-17
dreamweaver - http://faery.biz/publ/klassy/010_tkach_snov/2-1-0-12
| Sinist | 2013-07-09 16:32:51 |
| BadSleep | 2013-07-09 17:22:10 |
Weird, I cannot connect to this websites (timeout). Lol yes it's not skald2, I meant skald2.0. skald1.0, I don't know. I'm very naive and thought that version2.0 would be better, and the pictures were cool. You're in holidays, right? I should not bother you with these problems. I wasn't even sure to implement these classes, just wondering if it was somewhere on the prospectro website. I can't find anything by myself because of the russian language. thx anyway Edit : website works well now sry Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-09 23:54:38 | Floofy | 2013-07-09 20:16:40 |
Hey just tryed this, nice project
As others have said, this lacks something to be truly fun, but its nice to get an idea of how special class are played.
What did you code this in? i do have some experience programming.
| BadSleep | 2013-07-09 23:44:26 |
Yes I know it's hard to find some fun with it. It's written in Scala. Code is a mess, AI and graphic code being examples of what to not do imho. If you're interested to see what looks like the code of a class, you can read them here : https://github.com/illim/freespectro/tree/master/src/main/scala/priv/sp/house (simplest is dudemancer and most complicated should be Moutain King) Tell me if you're interested in adding one of your class suggestion, I'll be happy to tell you if it's doable or not and how to add it.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-10 00:10:46 | Floofy | 2013-07-10 03:51:14 |
Hmmm i shortly looked at Dude, and thats clearly really simple. Will need to look some more before i fully understand this, but yea i might be interested in creating some classes :)
| FORESTRY | 2013-07-10 06:29:06 |
BS, ive finished my brute data for Killratios, ill soon post it after i clean it up and make it readable.
| BadSleep | 2013-07-10 09:43:24 |
How do you decide to choose brute data or long term data? Do you calculate the healing possibility of your opponent? Maybe it's one of the problems of my AI, to deal with different possible path.
| BadSleep | 2013-07-10 11:55:34 |
| FORESTRY | 2013-07-10 13:00:43 |
How do you decide to choose brute data or long term data? Do you calculate the healing possibility of your opponent? Maybe it's one of the problems of my AI, to deal with different possible path. http://spectromancer.com/forum.cgi#pageid=3860If you have any questions ill do my best to answer.
| Sinist | 2013-07-10 14:02:35 |
Weird, I cannot connect to this websites (timeout). Lol yes it's not skald2, I meant skald2.0. skald1.0, I don't know. I'm very naive and thought that version2.0 would be better, and the pictures were cool. You're in holidays, right? I should not bother you with these problems. I wasn't even sure to implement these classes, just wondering if it was somewhere on the prospectro website. I can't find anything by myself because of the russian language. thx anyway
Edit : website works well now sry Maybe skald 2.0 is really better... and some cards of skald 1.0 could be reallyhard to code, I think
Dont worry, I will be glad to help you with illustration - but later
What class are you going to implement next?
| BadSleep | 2013-07-10 16:53:13 |
ok, I will try to add high priest, and put placeholders for the missing pictures.
| Sinist | 2013-07-10 18:02:59 |
ok, I will try to add high priest, and put placeholders for the missing pictures.
I have looked through master of wind - it is really cool to play with and against! Thank you very much for adding this fun class^_^
AI still behaves strangely - spamming uncharged griffins, for example. I wish I could play hotseat... Isit really that hard to implement, btw?(
Also, one more bug: dwaf 5 cannot be harmed while unopposed. I meant in description that he only reamins "half-invulnerable" while opposed...
| Sinist | 2013-07-10 18:04:45 |
2) And whirlwind shoudnt be able to target unopposed enemy creatures! Way too overpowered.
| Sinist | 2013-07-10 18:11:05 |
3) Simoon stuns special creatures too. Hmm...
4) Spirit of thunderstorm is supposed to damage opponent too. Well... it may be too much a bit, in this case you are free to reduce total damage from 4 to 3)
| BadSleep | 2013-07-10 18:13:51 |
Thanks for the feedback, and the bug report, I'll fix them. I think my brain is not functioning well with the heat.
When you say dwarf 5, you mean Runesmith?(5. Runesmith 7/23 - runesmith and opposite creature can be harmed only by each otherâs attacks. )
| Floofy | 2013-07-10 18:50:01 |
I also have a question... do you think this will eventually lead to
something usefull/fun/multiplayer, or its more like just for fun and you don't think
this will elvolve?
| BadSleep | 2013-07-10 19:30:33 |
This is just for fun, experimenting stuff, as it's done in the class suggestions.
It can be more interesting to experiment without facing the reality, just to write ideas on the paper, and think about the implications.
| Sinist | 2013-07-11 08:48:51 |
I also have a question... do you think this will eventually lead to something usefull/fun/multiplayer, or its more like just for fun and you don't think this will elvolve? Well, I personally hope that once this game could be played by people, even on one computerIt would be great way to test some strategies of those rather deep classes, taking into account that AI is sadly rather limited now.
BadSleep, I forgot to ask - what did you mea saying that Shaman (http://www.spectromancer.com/forum.cgi?t=3856&msg=42200#pageid=3034) has "randomness?"
Thanks for the feedback, and the bug report, I'll fix them. I think my brain is not functioning well with the heat.
When you say dwarf 5, you mean Runesmith?(5. Runesmith 7/23 - runesmith and opposite creature can be harmed only by each otherâs attacks. )
Yeah, runesmith. This guy ability should trigger only when he has smth in opposite slot... Btw, AI seems to never use 2 and 7-8 dwarf cards... Strange. | Sinist | 2013-07-11 14:36:49 |
Two more uestions - 1) what do you think of Mythomancer class? 2) Do you think that wind 4 is fine as it is, or maybe it should have additional effect "deals 1 damage to opponent and all his creatures" when casted?
| Sinist | 2013-07-11 15:58:27 |
3) Wht do new menu (0-1-2-3) in setting mean? 4) Imho berseker needs smll buff - his ability shoyld trigger when owner receives more than 4 dmg.. .5) Living sword and wind 6 probably need small hp nerf | BadSleep | 2013-07-11 19:42:02 |
1) I don't think much. Wavelength and Redrook like it a lot, so I guess it is good. I'm very far from finishing High priest, considering I have other things to do irl, so no hurry... 2) I think wind 4 is ok but maybe you're right I can add it for next version, just for a try. 3) You can forget this menu, it was for me to test the other old heuristic for the AI. 4) ok, I'm not sure I agree with you, but I'll change that, we'll see the result. 5) I don't know. I think Sword need an attack nerf(not sure about it, it seems fine depending on the situation) ;), but maybe you're right. About wind6, no idea. Don't hesitate to gather on a paper all the tweak you need for your classes. If they are just numbers to change I can do it rapidly. I should put these values in a file so you can edit them, but I don't have time for this now. (For hot seat, I still have these bugs on the multi I have to fix. Time and motivation lacks... - go in settings, choose Moutain King vs Moutain King - Go in multi settings, click on 'Serve' - open a new game, go in multi settings, and click on 'connect local' There you have something similar to hot seat, but it's bugged right now, if server surrender, it freeze, and if client connect before server listen, it also freeze.) Edit: for shaman, the randomness come from the slot where appears ghost wolf I also have a question, for Ouroboros, sepent is summoned, dies at the end of turn then reappears just after, right? or does it wait one turn before reappearing? Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-12 00:38:42 | Sinist | 2013-07-12 09:05:57 |
Thanks for detailed answers!
4, 5) Well, those suggestions were based on results of games vs AI. Sword is really hard to play agains (basically effect of cloud - but cheaper and tougher cloud), and several wind 6 ensure victory too often.
Server mode? Ok, I will give it a try!
Shaman? Oh, it is not a great deal. You can just make wold appear on start in most right slot)
Next turn ouroboros summons new serpent, yes.
And I think that dwarf 2 shoudnt protect dwarf 6 from its ability because: 1) it is overpowered combo 2) it is illogical since life loss is not equal to damage dealt - look at ice guard vs vampire cards
| Sinist | 2013-07-12 09:12:48 |
I got an idea for different Darksider 8. Do you think it easier to code?
8. Black dragon 8/40. Redirects spells targeted at him and damage from spells and creatures abilities to strongest enemy creature.
| BadSleep | 2013-07-12 18:50:49 |
I think you have too much ideas, and I seriously can't follow you. :) No more request please! don't sell your soul for peanuts. and pictures for prospectrogramma remains in prospectrogramma... In 10 days, high priest(don't expect too much from the result, I think I'm not doing a good job on this one, I mean worse than the others) + various fixes is my goal now. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-12 20:42:44 | LaoTse | 2013-07-12 19:08:41 |
Wow, 27 closed also full-screen, congratulations!
and pictures for prospectrogramma remains in prospectrogramma...
??? Is it out?? | BadSleep | 2013-07-12 19:30:47 |
plenty of stupid bugs, I assure you, and I still discover a tons every time I play for the fit screen, the result is a bit ugly, ahem, lol. psg, I don't know if it's released. I just realized that the pictures from http://faery.biz/publ/klassy/010_tkach_snov/2-1-0-12 were for propspectrogramma, so if I can, I prefer not to use them.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-12 19:31:56 | Sinist | 2013-07-15 12:02:16 |
(For hot seat, I still have these bugs on the multi I have to fix. Time and motivation lacks...
- go in settings, choose Moutain King vs Moutain King
- Go in multi settings, click on 'Serve'
- open a new game, go in multi settings, and click on 'connect local'
There you have something similar to hot seat, but it's bugged right now, if server surrender, it freeze, and if client connect before server listen, it also freeze.)
I tried to follow these steps, but connect local button becomes unavailable every time :-( P.S. Sorry if I bothered and scared you away with requests I just wanted to pay your attention to most interesting classes. So I will look forward to your High priest. I would be happy if you decided to implement Shaman/Darksider next but that`s all I was asking for
P.P.S.
Here you have sun stone, serpent, puzzle and dwarf
And prospectrogramma has not been released yet but I am sure Clever wouldnt mind if you took some pictures. It is one more fun project, after all)
Modified by Sinist on 2013-07-15 14:14:53 | Sinist | 2013-07-15 12:21:22 |
For wood eleves:
| Sinist | 2013-07-15 12:22:06 |
5-8
| BadSleep | 2013-07-16 16:14:21 |
Great pictures, thank you.
| BadSleep | 2013-07-17 12:02:47 |
Hi, sorry I don't have time to fix my bugs. I made a not well polished version with High priest. It's too much time consuming, 2 class in one. So I gave up on the polishing. There's some very interesting cards, like Ammit, Simoom or Babi. I don't have the time and the courage to test it deeply, so I'm not sure about the balance and the card flow usage. Other changes: tweak Berserker, fix runesmith, tweak squall, whirlwind select owner creature, spirit of thunderstorm hit player, added a button in debug to give mana for testing purpose, put the pictures outside the archive so you can put the prospectrogramma pictures if you want. I know the AI is still crap, and the multi does not work well, but I'm done for now, and need to put aside this project. Please no request except minor modifications. edit: apis was bugged sry Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-17 14:29:56 | Sinist | 2013-07-17 14:45:27 |
No more requests, I see Still, you have done a great work! I appreciate your efforts Some minor notes about: -why you tweaked berserker? Imho he is slightly underpowered comparing with chastiser -serpopards should have a bit less hp. Too powerful rush. -While total level of my air and water creatures was higher, the deck was Raâs. Only fire and earth belong to Ra. -Ammit special ability doesnt work it seems... -Apis doesnt give hp to owner (eye of wadjet - too). -AI just summoned titan in empty slot... XD P.S. Troppers class is so lol Starcraft rocks! Hope you will come back once!.. Modified by Sinist on 2013-07-17 14:58:40 | BadSleep | 2013-07-17 15:34:51 |
Berseker is reacting when player damage is above 4 and not 5. Just fixed Ammit(broke nosferatu at the same time), apis, wajet, sorry. For the total level problem and choice between ra and set, I couldn't reproduce your problem sorry.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-17 15:36:55 | Sinist | 2013-07-17 15:57:47 |
Berseker is reacting when player damage is above 4 and not 5.
Just fixed Ammit(broke nosferatu at the same time), apis, wajet, sorry.
For the total level problem and choice between ra and set, I couldn't reproduce your problem sorry. Ok. I meant that if total level of fire and earth creatures is higher, deck should turn into Ra`s, not vice versa
| Sinist | 2013-07-17 16:05:21 |
And tis beastly Apep decreases only owner powers, nothis opponent as well | BadSleep | 2013-07-17 16:12:28 |
arf lol I misread i thought it was based on mana, I'll change that Hmm, Apep, it's written Every turn decreases elemental powers of both players by 1. What's his correct behavior? Every turn decreases owner elemental powers by 1? Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-17 16:26:11 | Sinist | 2013-07-17 16:32:49 |
"Every turn decreases elemental powers of owner and opponent by 1"
| BadSleep | 2013-07-17 16:39:58 |
oh I think I understand the problem. You want effect also happen on opponent's turn? I made it happen only on owner's turn. So the turn after it's summoned, you will see opponent's mana increase, but decrease only on owner's turn. In general, for a card when I say every turn increase mana by 1 for example, I imagine every owner's turn. ok one more bug to fix. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-17 16:42:02 | Sinist | 2013-07-17 16:46:18 |
This is strange interpretation... Right now opponent`s powers growth too while I meant it to be sort of astral guard but for both players | BadSleep | 2013-07-17 17:10:15 |
Sorry, I think I'm too influenced by the code and think like a robot instead of trying to understand the user. Btw, I don't really like this card. I guess that's why I didn't tested much Apep. I had a game that was slow as hell after I summoned it. I guess it should be played very tactically to avoid being too boring, like death 7. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-07-17 17:12:52 | BadSleep | 2013-07-17 17:21:16 |
should be fixed now
| Sinist | 2013-07-17 17:38:19 |
Sorry, I think I'm too influenced by the code and think like a robot instead of trying to understand the user.
Btw, I don't really like this card. I guess that's why I didn't tested much Apep. I had a game that was slow as hell after I summoned it. I guess it should be played very tactically to avoid being too boring, like death 7. It really has death-like specific but still allows to play agressively with special cards being powerhouse itself. should be fixed now | BadSleep | 2013-08-27 19:03:45 |
added Shaman
| Sinist | 2013-08-28 08:30:44 |
Very cool! Nice to see one of my best classes here I have found so far several bugs: -Hunger cannot target enemy creatures. -Permanent bonus disappears after wolf death -magical defence from spirit protector doesnt seem to work. And damage reduction (maybe I am wrong though) halves incoming dmg, not simply decreases it by 2 -Also, I guess that damage from phantom fury can be safely reduced to 7 (and shadow hp to 45, protector hp to 20) -Wolf shadow ability doesnt seem to work correctly (it should get permanent bonud damage/damage reduction as well. For example, if spirit of rage was placed between shadow and wold, wolf should get +1 attack, shadow - +2 attack) -Ai seems to use high level water cards very rarely. Strange... Also - do you still take requests? If so, I would be happy to see once Devils, Darkside (black dragon has been reworked) and Mythomancer classes. And if you got tired of my suggestions, there are a lot of other cool ideas, mainly by RedRook and Wave... Sadly they have no pictures right now However, Enthomologist by RedRook ( http://prospectro.ru/blog/experiment/1245.html) and Ninja by Dyscord ( http://prospectro.ru/blog/experiment/1326.html) have already been illustrated
Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-28 10:02:42 | Sinist | 2013-08-28 09:55:07 |
P.S. Since wolf appears in random slot I guees you mastered random feature of cards? Cool | BadSleep | 2013-08-28 10:56:03 |
No it's still bugged, but I have to rewrite the bot entirely I think, and no I don't take requests, sorry. Thanks for the bugs list. I didn't realize that permanent bonus means bonus remaining after death(very good with F3 ). And shadow inherits from the bonus of wolf. I thought only the special spells/creatures just have same effects on shadow, arg. If orc is near ghost wolf, shadow should get also same bonus , and i heal wolf, shadow should be healed too! nice idea.(don't tell me that killing wolf kill shadow too, or tornado wolf kill also shadow, or stun wolf stun shadow) I think I'll rename this to BuggedShaman and fix it in a month maybe.
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-08-28 11:35:45 | Sinist | 2013-08-28 13:19:57 |
Oh, I see Permanent bonus was supposed to remain after death, similiar to golen (golem master). In this case wolf should have cost 3 though, I think. You got it right about shadow This feature was that should have made it really unique card. I will look forward to new versions of freespectro! 
Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-28 13:20:18 | Sinist | 2013-08-28 14:18:05 |
One more bug: after casting hunger on shadow and wolf I destroyed everything except shadow with armageddon... which somehow keeps bonus attack now
P.S. Is it possible to make statistics show after match, like in standart Spectro?
Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-28 14:34:49 | BadSleep | 2013-08-28 14:54:29 |
Yes man, I may add them later. Now I'm thinking about it, maybe I have an idea about playing against each other in multiplayer without adding a server. Maybe we could try with I2P. It's a client for encrypted communication ( http://www.i2p2.de/). One feature is to create tunnels. Maybe it could work. If you are ingame this evening, we could try it. | Sinist | 2013-08-28 16:19:42 |
Well, why not to give it a try. When will you be online? | BadSleep | 2013-08-28 16:56:52 |
I don't know, I'll try to be around, after 19h in France -> 21h in Moscow. not working  Modified by BadSleep on 2013-08-29 16:45:48 | Sinist | 2013-08-28 18:05:41 |
...Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-28 18:32:27 | BadSleep | 2013-08-29 17:24:38 |
Partly fixed shaman, but I changed hunger to : wolf receives +X attack (X - attack of strongest creature on board) for 1 turn. Is it ok?
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-08-29 17:28:24 | Sinist | 2013-08-30 12:57:30 |
Partly fixed shaman, but I changed hunger to : wolf receives +X attack (X - attack of strongest creature on board) for 1 turn.
Is it ok? Very nice!
| BadSleep | 2013-08-30 19:06:47 |
Modified by BadSleep on 2013-08-30 19:23:15 | Sinist | 2013-08-30 19:33:16 |
Excellent work, again! -Wolf spider doesnt seem to work correctly. I will search later for more bugs. One more question: do you tkink you could add most of basic Spectro classes (except mech, chaos and goblin ofcourse) in time? They have already been well balanced, and are probably already coded, so it must be not so hard (and a lot of fun to test oldies vs newbies))... What do you think? | BadSleep | 2013-08-30 19:54:18 |
arf you're too fast. I realized I introduced bugs with Warp and deleted my message. Don't worry about bugs, in general after playing a week, I discover a lot of them. I'm just worried that sometimes I misunderstand the effects, like for Wolf shadow. Thanks to the class reviewers (mostly Redrook and Wavelength), I'm enlightened by their reflection. For example at the beginning, I thought that blocking a card, was freezing a creature . The weird thing is that it was clear a month ago, that it affects the deck, but today I spent a lot of times realizing it was removing the card from the deck. For the basic spectro classes, I don't think I will add them. For copyrights but also because it takes time(already coded?) and I still need to rewrite the bot, and the net code. Why "except chaos and goblin of course"? also spectro mages will be ashamed to fall in my nightmare ;). What do you think of current balance? I think best balanced class is Sower. Dark priest is strong but I think there's a deck configuration, DP1, 4, 6, 8 with W6, W10, E1 against a good rusher, it seems impossible to win. Dudes are a bit too strong because the early creatures are just too big. Bill Bull is like Dorlak but without the sacrifice. Master of wind reminds a bit sorcery because it needs some good basic creatures. Elementalist is also very strong with salamander and avalanche. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-08-30 20:29:03 | Sinist | 2013-08-31 07:47:23 |
I see. It is strange but many new players learn some term only after thousands of games. Well, I doubt that there would be problem with copyright (there is free flash version with much better graphics anyway), but if it is too complex... Speaking about RedRook, you might like his Hedge Wizard class (which has been illustrated too) Oh, I meant that you said on your wiki that you cannot code random efefcts... It has changed by now I guess. No, they would be happy to find new worthy opponents to battle;) Also, one more reason to add basic one could be that they would help to find flaws in introduced class suggestions due to good balance and design (for example, necromancer vs darksider, hermit vs shaman, sorcerer vs elementalist, druid vs mountain king) As for balance, I am not sure about Sower (top cards seem overpowered a bit); imho, Mountain King is better balanced, as well as dreamweaver (flying castle and butterfly should have less life though I believe) and troopers. Both Dark Priest and Elementalist are hot-and-cold depending on draw. I disagree about dudes - their biggest weakness is predictability (lack of special effect is a huge flaw). Master of Wind inspires illusion (and time)-like feeling; it is likely to be screwed with bad elemental draw, but you are more likely to get screwed with bad healing. Shaman is tad overpowered (what do you think?). Zen and Warp are pretty weak. What a pity that there is no way to make multiplayer work
P.S> Is it possible to make small pictures turn into big ones when clicked like in standart Spectromancer?
Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-31 09:21:01 | Sinist | 2013-08-31 08:06:27 |
P.P.S. Warlock ability is bugged... It is probably because you decided that "blocks spells" means "losing its card" - but in this case blocking means really blocking (negating) - at the cost of his life (+ several hp and 4X damage should probably be fine. And +4-5 hp to dark mystic, -4 hp to lake) Modified by Sinist on 2013-08-31 11:42:22 | BadSleep | 2013-08-31 12:04:56 |
hehe ok thank you for the precision. Fixed now, kept 3x, fixed dark mystic hp -> 27, lake hp -> 41. and no big picture sorry :( I didn't played enough Shaman to say it's too strong (Shaman2+E3 is probably OP). Definitively needs a multiplayer | Sinist | 2013-08-31 12:58:50 |
Oh, I didnt mean that dark mystic should have 26 (!) hp. 21 must be more than enough. It is just that it had only 15 hp in previous version - I dunno why... Yeah... Have you talked with Clever about this problem? | Candidate | 2013-08-31 15:03:29 |
Maybe TeamViewer can help to play single duels against a human. But if you use TeamViewer, both playes will have the opportunity to see opponents' cards.
| CIever | 2013-08-31 15:23:19 |
Yeah... Have you talked with Clever about this problem? i have to notice that my current solution, which i have been setting up for this week would not work neither with scala nor with java-like programs. And i definitely don't know how to set up AI - in this case BadSleeps' version is much more interesting (i even do not know how to implement the basics of cards' chhosing by computer without kilometres of code) | Sinist | 2013-09-05 11:46:20 |
Some tips: Darksider: -Faceless horror is elementals killer. He also totally shuts down shaman if opponent was not careful enough to keep wolf blocked. -Warlock is an excellent rush (spider-minotaur-cloud-etc.) support very useful against dragon/Armageddon as well. -Black Dragageddon+golems=win Mountain king: -Berserker is the best friend of rejuvenation and ice uard. -Shieldmen combine greatly with ballista, cloud, mind master and many other vulnerable cards. -Dwarven soldiers adore forest sprites. Master of wind: -Simoom is great with elementals. Dragon is great with everything that wind has. -Two squalls in row allow to simultaneously cast Armageddon/stone rain and attack next turn with 2 powerful creatures. Shaman: -Low level cards are good in rush while high level ones are aimed at long game. Use wolf 1+wolf7/8 to defend against late game pressure. Some balance thoughts: -Imho, flying castle is quite overpowered. I recommend to nerf damage reduction to 1. And buuterfly should affect only elemental cards. -Prisoner shouldnât have negative effect, imho -Wolf spider needs a bit better stats. 3/16 would probably be fine. - -4 hp to warlock. -8 hp to Apep. -2 hp to spirit of storm. +3 hp to runesmith. +1-3 hp to almost all junk creatures/ Modified by Sinist on 2013-09-06 10:20:27 | BadSleep | 2013-09-06 08:45:00 |
Thanks for the tips. I updated warlock(also fixed a bug where mana of the blocked spell was not consumed); Apep, spirit of storm, runesmith and wolf spider. For my classes, I can't find a way to balance them without killing the idea behind. Warp is the worst. With warp 2, 7 having negative synergy, it can't stop a sea sprite rush.
| Sinist | 2013-09-06 08:54:23 |
You are welcome!) Actually I suggested only minor changes which canot kill idea anyway I guess I will think more of Warp balance... | Sinist | 2013-09-07 06:46:04 |
As for Warp, I think that actuallu most of its cards are fine - maybe a bit more hp but generally okay. It os not weak at all. Howerver I dont get what Photographeris supposed to do at all...
P.S. Can you make wolf appear in most right slot, not random, please?
| BadSleep | 2013-09-07 15:32:16 |
ok right most. no problemo
| Sinist | 2013-09-07 16:08:01 |
ok right most. no problemo Do you like my Fairy Knight, btw?
| BadSleep | 2013-09-07 17:41:42 |
Hmm, the pictures are cool, but I didn't have the time to look into the details. Currently the project is in pause again. If I compare the time I waste to add a class and the time I spend playing it, it's not really worth it. The AI is just too bad. It's just cool to have a bigger variety of opponents. I haven't played Shaman or Darksider enough. Black knight is quite original btw. One problem is that I implement your classes, and before I understand how to play them, you're already in need for another one because you don't really have to discover them. I thought of adding Entomologist as you suggested, but I was a bit busy lately. The bot is still bugged for random effects. I doubt I can add a good implementation of Fairy Knight. Maybe next week, it's supposed to be rainy here, so maybe I will have more time. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-09-07 18:56:53 | Sinist | 2013-09-08 07:35:33 |
Oh, I see. So the problem is thay you pay a lot of attention to analyzing classes in battle while me, having created and/or seen them multiple times before, spend less time learning them True, bot is too rushy (even archmage suffers fron this though), howerver, imho, your "hotseat" is rather useful for testing classes and balance (as long as both players choose optimal moves of course). Anyway, I will be happy to see updates whateveer they are) Keep working! It is a pity that I am the only one who comments this thread... It deserves more | FORESTRY | 2013-09-10 05:28:07 |
Well, I check in here, but it's mostly about integration of new classes and bugs in their implementation...
.
The most interesting thing to me are the combat algorithms, but that is rarely spoken of, and i already provided the raw data for "killratios", so I don't know how to provide anything useful beyond that.
| LaoTse | 2013-09-10 08:56:33 |
| BadSleep | 2013-09-10 10:02:46 |
lol, sadly I was a real programmer before, that would explain my habit using bugs reports. Now I'm busy trying to find a job, but as I'm not good at programming, I try to find something else. But probably I'll do programming again, I guess boring enterprise stuff, because I'm too old to start something else. For this project, I don't have much inspiration currently, and motivation lacks. - netcode: probably I will improve a few stuff, for debugging purpose, but nothing great. - ai: needs to be rewritten. Currently, I don't have any idea how to include the random feature (having a bigger search tree?), and how to interface with the gameplay code(a crappy side effect?). - gameplay: I'm stuck on Entomologist, but didn't make a single progress in a week. Not very motivated. the more I play this little game, the more I like the design of spectro classes, especially Illusion, Cultist, Golem, Demon and vampire. Modified by BadSleep on 2013-09-10 10:07:13 | LaoTse | 2013-09-10 14:20:05 |
...because I'm too old to start something else.
You mean this are the thoughts of the employers...because if it were your thoughts...I would kick your ass, that you would run like a 14 year old......I´m 2617 years old now and still feel like 17...there´s no trick!...it´s just, sometimes we have to clean our "house" and put all the useless garbage in the trashcan...an empty room is never empty...it´s full of ideas...an overfilled room is always empty...empty of space...for example, I have no TV, because it kills my power...I really don´t need this mindfuck-machine, that always tells me, what I have to think...A friend told me, that Michael Jackson is dead and Pope Benedikt had withdrawn, but is it important, what happens with so little fishes?...now a flower is on the place that was filled by the useless TV before...the TV never spoke to me, because a dead machine can´t give any messages...but the flower is a living thing...it speaks very silent...but the message is unambiguous!...
| BadSleep | 2013-09-10 16:51:56 |
hmm, ... and a flower at the TV?
| BadSleep | 2013-09-26 10:06:30 |
Just to let you know. I added Entomologist. Nice class, very clean and coherent design (some cards seems slightly op or underpowered in some situations) Modified by BadSleep on 2013-09-27 00:49:20 | Sinist | 2013-10-01 17:07:13 |
Nice addon! | Sinist | 2013-10-03 18:22:30 |
By the way, BadSleep; I have asked Cooler himself if it permitted to insert original classes in Spectro mods. He answered "yes". So if you will ever get such intention... It would be nice to see | LaoTse | 2013-10-03 19:15:30 |
Great Sinist!
"Cooler himself..."
"Spectro mods" is not correct, this is freeSpectro!
You two are a great pair, you give him the steam that he needs, or in other words, you give him the lovely asskicks that he needs...(Don´t take me to serious. According to Tosher, I´m just a child...and I think, he´s right...)
| LaoTse | 2013-10-05 06:50:26 |
BadSleep...I have played it intensively the last days, and it´s really , very great job!
especially for Griffin, I added it in Spectro, looks really good (even in big)...
Is Apprentice the strongest bot? Played all 4, and this bot was really good for Java-dimensions. Sure nothing compared to Archy...but Archy isn´t a bot, he´s an AI...I mean a Demon, catched by Cooler, and now caught in Spectro for all times...
Faerie Apprentice has still 11 life and Steam Tank still 60...but as long as you don´t implement more Spectro-classes, it´s not really important...
You should the bot always give the first move imo...
You are soooooooo Pro, really! But your life is much more important...if you prefer to stop here, Sinist and I understand this fully np! Right Sinist? Cheers BadSleep! (left Lao, right Sinist)
| BadSleep | 2013-10-05 16:28:37 |
Cool. Well, I don't take this project too seriously. I hope it's the same for you. For griffin, the pic come from WillOfSauron if I remember well. Good to know that it's ok to add spectro classes, even if I have no motivation to add them, as I already explained. I never play with Troopers personally. If someone else could add them, that would be great.
| LaoTse | 2013-10-05 19:38:36 |
No, I don´t take it serious at all! The bot is crap compared to Archy, but Cooler is not a programmer, he´s an artist...have never seen such a crazy AI in any game except chess...all can just do what you have done, writing a bot...but creating an AI is higher art lol!
Seems Sinist is the only one, who takes it serious lol...Since I see no stabilization atm in your life, you should stop here atm and give Sinist the love that he needs a bit later...I can´t program, otherwise I would do it for Sinist...
| LaoTse | 2013-10-07 02:42:27 |
BadSleep, now I want something from you too...
I want to add the 3 spells Chain lightning(A8), Fury(E6) and Acidic shower(W8) in Spectro, but I have no big tga...
Can you please create me a big image for this 3 spells and upload them here via a download link?
That would be really great, if you do this for me!
| BadSleep | 2013-10-07 15:59:18 |
| LaoTse | 2013-10-07 18:27:10 |
No, for this 3 spells your pics are much better (W8 slightly). I already tried it, downloading IrfanView, but just enlarge doesn´t work, because it never fits the circle, no matter what you do...your Fury also doesn´t fit the circle, just nearly, so a lot better than my tries...but thanks for doing this!
I can´t open tgas with Paint, otherwise it would be easy...so what to download now??
| LaoTse | 2013-10-07 18:36:27 |
Ah, I see now...there are 2 versions...the Windows7-version is not the full...wtf!...
Thank you very much for your help!
| LaoTse | 2013-10-08 03:35:29 |
Man, is this damn hard work!!!
I finally managed it with Gimp...(W8 not, because looks bad enlarged...)
A friend told me once, that programmer is the hardest job ever...imo he´s right! (left BadSleep, right Lao...)
Again , also to Forestry for mentioning Gimp...
| Sinist | 2013-10-25 18:43:05 |
... Hmm, yeah, I'm not working on my
project, but there were days I found myself adding a card, and weeks
passing finally made the class.
For 6, my implementation is maybe not ideal because there's some memory work to remember what was the initial deck.
Imho
this class can be a bit frustrating to play against, but the ideas are
interesting, and it's very nice discovering new styles of play. thank
you Sinist for sharing these ideas. Though, 2 and 4 (and a bit 7) are
not my cup of tea.
Very nice addon, BadSleep! Thank you a lot! I like implemention of 6 - it is probably best of possible in this programm The only bug I have found so far is that 6 seems to block even cards which have been blocked previous turn... but this is not important anyway) Do you plan to add something else in, let us ay, a month or so?
| BadSleep | 2013-10-25 19:45:14 |
No, I have nothing on my mind currently, except maybe changing how the bot behaves in the end game.
Do you know if by chance the class catalog on prospectro can be restored?
| Sinist | 2013-10-26 09:22:25 |
No, I have nothing on my mind currently, except maybe changing how the bot behaves in the end game.
Do you know if by chance the class catalog on prospectro can be restored? It can and probably will be one day... Right now catalogue by Clever can be used) It doesnt have the latest classes though.
| Sinist | 2014-01-12 08:44:01 |
Will there be any updates?
| BadSleep | 2014-01-17 23:05:48 |
Probably no. I found a job recently and I have barely the time to rest and play Spectromancer. I introduced a bug in last version where I added a dumb random management in the AI, also started Hedge wizard, but I gave up when I was stuck on the card that played another card. Sorry, maybe if I get fired in a month I'll continue on this. Modified by BadSleep on 2014-02-21 21:33:17 | Sinist | 2015-05-26 20:54:29 |
Abandoned... Thats a pity | CyberneticPony | 2015-05-27 00:05:03 |
Abandoned... Thats a pity
I doubt there's much interest to revive this anyway.
| BadSleep | 2015-05-27 20:11:43 |
Haha, indeed, I don't have much time these days. Who know if I loose my job soon, or whatever happens, maybe I'll try stuff with it.
| BadSleep | 2015-10-11 14:26:54 |
No new features, I just recoded the gui to use libgdx. Some effects doesn't work anymore+some glitch, but there's a house description dialog if you click on the special house label, which can be helpful if you don't have in mind how some exotic house is supposed to work. https://www.dropbox.com/s/tzu2lp9yny3z749/freespectrogdx.jar?dl=0(you need java. Double-click on the jar file, if it doesn't work, right click then open with java, or java -jar thejarfile on the command line). Edit: this should work on linux and probably also on macosx btw(edit2 : aye not working). Modified by BadSleep on 2015-10-15 15:46:41 | Sinist | 2015-10-12 20:17:07 |
Wow. Glad you still remember this project! Now it looks way smoother
will you develop it further?
| BadSleep | 2015-10-12 21:56:52 |
Nothing to expect soon, except cosmetics and fixing bugs, but if I find new opportunities and time to improve this project, I'll take them.
(For example, I was looking for adding audio, but the ratio, time to work on it vs fun, may not be worth it.)
| Sinist | 2015-10-13 13:39:17 |
I see. So no more classes?(
| BadSleep | 2015-10-24 11:27:48 |
Not necessarily, added Antimancer(Tiapoka), Faerie Druid(Valentyne) and Keeper of limbo(Fuzzer). There are still bugs, weird freeze and I didn't find the right pictures I think.
| Sinist | 2015-10-24 12:38:01 |
Very coold additions! Sometimes game crashes, though :-( Wonder what owners of these classes will think of them... Valentyne, come on? Would also love to see in future such CS as Tidecaller, Devils, Pack 1.0; Seasons and Energy by Wave
+more basic classes. Since they are already balanced, it would make sense to test balance of cards vs them
or at least add cards bans and 1% rule...
Modified by Sinist on 2015-10-24 13:52:12 | Sinist | 2015-10-24 14:26:42 |
Balance notes: AI a bit too slow to react Mirror priest - reduce attack to 1 Martyr needs more hp and less attack. I assume that he resurrects only cards killed by spells, right? Runesmith - should be damaged only by opposite creature, which however can be damaged by anything. -1 hp Resistance OP at the beginning, dunno what to do with it Vodoo doll doesnât regenerate when draining hp Photographer should work only on elemental creatures and have only 16 hp Redemption way worse than ritual of glory, needs to summon 2 copies then Limbo wraith +10 hp Limbo baron - when enters the game, doubles its attack, too Nether grasp 6 damage for each limbo creature Heavens Keeper + 3 hp Harvester 4/37 Bribery - power cost 10 or less Nightwing butterfly -2 hp Please replace Hydra with this pic, looks way better: < https://www.dropbox.com/sh/br6fjf3io5c98kv/AAA-wZhaUfHVb_tFrF-kPpwla?preview=Hydra.JPG>; Btw backgrounds are cool =) | Wavelength | 2015-10-25 07:19:30 |
I don't know if Wavelength read this topic, but I was thinking about adding a dummy implementation of Dreamweaver. Can I? This is WAY late (I didn't see it before), but yes - please feel free to add any of my suggested classes to your gane!
| BadSleep | 2015-10-25 23:19:54 |
thanks! Sinist, does it mean that Runesmith is invincible if unopposed and is not affected by spells? (sry martyr & resistance should be fixed now) Modified by BadSleep on 2015-10-25 23:35:55 | Sinist | 2015-10-26 09:00:26 |
Sinist, does it mean that Runesmith is invincible if unopposed and is not affected by spells? (sry martyr & resistance should be fixed now) no, if unopposed ability doesnt work of course. Spells dont affect him when opposed. Maybe even -2 hp
| BadSleep | 2015-10-30 21:06:41 |
oki. Added a version of Colors(Madhatter) and Soul Reaper(ionasku), modified a bit the description of Crimson. Soul reaper deserve some visual effects, sry I didn't have time/idea for it. Gold is a bit weird, because there's no visual indicator for the 'X' value. (It's been a few years that their pics were on my computer, I needed to add them ^^)
Modified by BadSleep on 2015-10-30 21:08:45 | Sinist | 2015-10-31 16:32:08 |
So will there appear more basic classes -or at least add cards bans and 1% rule?| BadSleep | 2015-10-31 21:53:38 |
| Sinist | 2015-11-01 01:30:13 |
It would make game significantly more balanced overall
Btw, Wave, have you tested some of classes presented here?
| Sinist | 2015-11-02 04:30:12 |
Violet OP, needs to be switched to cost 4
Gold should resurrect creature with max hp (not higher), and of level not higher than 10
Azure needs ban with stone rain-armageddon, thatâs for sure
Number of souls is not depicted ((
onslaught should not reset amount of souls to zero; damage X+4
Dark passage - heal owner as well
Death sentence - better âdeals 28 damage to all creatures»
Furious souls deal 3X+10 damage to opponent
Soul shackles better not to destroy slot permanently
And it seems you didnât take into account yet balance notes above(
One last important question: what about hot seat function, to test class balance vs yourself rather than dumb AI?
| BadSleep | 2015-11-02 10:12:49 |
Damn! you don't see the number of souls below the life? I guess it's not playable for you, sry... I balance my classes, you can tell me how to balance yours, and I still hope that creators of the other classes tell me how to balance theirs. I didn't play enough, but I agree that Bribery and Furious souls are overpowered. It can be improved but I like Soul shackles now . Death sentence, I guess some people love death 7 here , why not.
No hot seat, it requires a major rework in my code, and I don't have the time now. Note: ppl can fork my code https://github.com/illim/freespectrogdx and make their own version. Considering the popularity of this awful game, I guess it will never be the case lol.
Sinist I made too much classes for you, and I may add some others if I have the time. You have the same illusion as me, that it's fun to play our classes, but I think it is not. Just consider yourself lucky being able to enjoy it. Personally I can't resist playing sometimes some Dark Priest vs Shaman, Warp vs Darksider, Snowblood vs Disciples, anything vs Fairy Druid/Colors/Limbo is also fun, and I find myself playing a bit with your Elementals class even if I really don't like Salamander. I know Resistance is OP, but I find it fun to look for counter measures like SoulReaper+F2 for example.
Man I do hated Locust swarm at first sight, but check this screenshot, this was a fun game where ai wait to put his mind master on w6, put locust on everything but with eternal rage I made it survive, just enough to kill it , and I can heal the cloud who is poisoned maybe to stall and use death sentence, etc ... lol
| Sinist | 2015-11-02 14:59:41 |
Oh, actually most of soul cards are currently underpowered imho) Thats why I offered to improve them No hot seat, its a pity... Sure, but it is not like I propose only my classes to add. Anyway, this game definitely needs more balancing | BadSleep | 2015-11-02 20:54:06 |
kk, you convinced me to add a simplified 1% rule, add the rule avoiding adjacent card for water/air/earth in 90% of the cases which may lead to have less than 10% chance to have adjacent cards but I don't know how much, close to 5% I guess. Modified by BadSleep on 2015-11-02 21:28:21 | Sinist | 2015-11-02 23:07:56 |
Nice! definitely looks better A pity AI is still quite dumb please take into account specific cards balance notes above
P.S. Now amount of souls visible
Resistance should probably decrease all owner powers by 1 when casted
Salamander might deal less direct damage (4) but have better stats (+1 attack,+1 hp)
Modified by Sinist on 2015-11-03 02:42:43 | BadSleep | 2015-11-15 18:49:00 |
last update and probably the last for a while: added a simplified (and probably bugged) version of seasons(wavelength), soulbinder(redrook), kinetician(sinist). (+ tweak salamander and zen focus to avoid having 3 focus in the game doing nearly the same thing) Sry, can't add the other requested classes because no idea how to implement them.
Modified by BadSleep on 2015-11-15 18:50:00 | RedRook | 2015-11-16 00:01:43 |
last update and probably the last for a while: added a simplified (and probably bugged) version of seasons(wavelength), soulbinder(redrook), kinetician(sinist). (+ tweak salamander and zen focus to avoid having 3 focus in the game doing nearly the same thing) Sry, can't add the other requested classes because no idea how to implement them. That is awesome! Thanks! I am flattered that you used one of my classes. Thank you! & very nice work by the way - you've put a lot of time into this. Why have I not been keeping up with this!? Thanks for all of your hard work & effort & time, BadSleep. Also, where do download the most recent version of this? | BadSleep | 2015-11-16 00:22:19 |
The link in the first post is still valid. It remains the most recent version.You need to install java to run it. (you can also check the project wiki) Modified by BadSleep on 2015-11-17 20:09:49 | RedRook | 2015-11-17 20:30:45 |
The link in the first post is still valid. It remains the most recent version.You need to install java to run it. (you can also check the project wiki) Great! Thanks, BadSleep! | Sinist | 2015-12-24 20:20:55 |
I posted link to Prospectro players. They generally like the game but... it is really a pity you cannot introduce multiplayer feature | BadSleep | 2015-12-25 22:07:38 |
yeah I know. I hope to have some time to work on this game again.
| Sinist | 2016-01-19 15:59:36 |
Bumped. Hopefully here it will receive more attention | BadSleep | 2016-06-07 11:17:43 |
There's now a multiplayer version, a bit bugged, and I didn't tested with more than 2 players. The server is on a temporary host. To play connect then search for an opponent.
A lot of things todo (bugfixing, select a player to duel, alert, search loop, gui improvement, duel chat... etc)
Modified by BadSleep on 2016-06-07 20:41:45 | Sinist | 2016-06-08 20:20:49 |
wow, glad to see your back!
Its definitely wort testing... when will you be online?
| BadSleep | 2016-06-08 20:45:17 |
Haha it's terrible now, I really need to polish this :p Skip button doesn't work:( Thank you very much for having tried it. I wasn't sure if any people was motivated for this. I already start listing issues ( https://github.com/illim/freespectrogdx/issues/6) Modified by BadSleep on 2016-06-08 21:15:00 | BadSleep | 2016-06-10 13:35:01 |
Hmm, I fixed the skip button. The gui is a little bit more readable but it's still not possible to make a duel request to a specific player or refusing a duel. The file is on the old dropbox link. Sometimes the server stop. I'm not sure why, maybe it's because the host I'm using, which is in beta phase and is free currently, has the right to stop the applications they're hosting. I have to restart manually now. the source code is also on github: https://github.com/illim/fserve, in case the server stop and someone wants to run his own. Modified by BadSleep on 2016-06-10 13:35:35 | Sinist | 2016-06-10 22:38:14 |
I think dueling specific player is one important prority
maybe register on prospetcro and create thread for discussion there? This thread has alreayd drowned in hundreds posts but sadly almost nobody other than me seems to response here...
btw have sent email
| BadSleep | 2016-06-11 09:04:45 |
ok it's done, not very user friendly, just type "/duel otherplayername" and the other guy accept with "/duel playername". I agree this thread is huge. I'll try to find another place to chat. (maybe https://gitter.im/illim/freespectrogdx ?) Modified by BadSleep on 2016-06-11 09:29:44 | Sinist | 2016-06-11 09:37:24 |
better go to prospectro I think
have seen my email letter?
| BadSleep | 2016-06-19 22:09:36 |
| Sinist | 2016-06-20 09:11:37 |
responded with email
| zzzzzz1 | 2017-11-05 21:54:48 |
Hi, Badsleep where can play your game?
| Sinist_ | 2017-11-06 11:31:59 |
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